Question

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Nadir

What is the fallacy when someone accusses another less of what they themselves do.

What is the fallacy of when someone who counter-accuses another of doing less of what they do?

So for example I drink a glass of alcohol a week, but criticize someone for being an alcoholic and drinking several times a day.

Because that person's alcoholic behavior is troubling to others , I rightfully criticize their alcoholism.

But their reply "you drink too" is what fallacy?

It cannot be appeal to hypocrisy, since that appears to someone pointing out an equally bad thing you do in reaction to your accusation.

But what is the fallacy of when they accuse you of doing less of what they've done such as the example I wrote above?

 

 

asked on Friday, Sep 01, 2023 01:45:20 AM by Nadir

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Answers

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Petra Liverani
4

As Bo says it may be more a strawman fallacy but it might also be considered an example of false equivalence.

The basic idea behind a false equivalence is captured by the common phrase “you can’t compare apples to oranges.”

Logical Form of False Equivalences
Here is the standard logical form of a false equivalence fallacy.

A and B share properties a, b, and, c
Therefore, A and B also share properties d, e, or, f.

So you share the property of drinking alcohol but you don't share the property of drinking alcohol excessively.

answered on Friday, Sep 01, 2023 07:45:13 AM by Petra Liverani

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TrappedPrior (RotE) writes:

This is it for me. The person saying, "you drink too" is glossing over the differences between drinking moderately and drinking excessively.

 

posted on Saturday, Sep 02, 2023 11:11:51 PM
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Dr. Richard
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First, let’s get the definition of an alcoholic as the word is used in common parlance: it is anyone who drinks more than I do. 

In addition to the other errors noted, I nominate Tu quoque (“you too”) is an appeal to hypocrisy. The argument states that a specific position is false or wrong and/or should be disregarded because its proponent fails to act consistently following that position.

Of course, the Fallacy of Diversion comes in (when you divert the discussion to something more comfortable when you have no answer to the topic at hand) because one wants to divert the focus to the other person’s drinking.

Let’s not forget the Appeal to Righteous Indignation in defense of drinking. A person claims to be offended, insulted, or hurt by criticism of a proposition he holds, or the advancement of a proposition with which he disagrees. Intrinsic to this fallacy is the principle that attacks upon an idea are morally equivalent (verbal or physical) to attacks on a person, and an attack on an idea justifies a response equal to or greater than the initial “attack.”

And, since “you drink too much,” the Fallacy of the Argument from Intimidation (appeals to moral self-doubt and reliance on the victim’s fear, guilt, or ignorance. It is used as an ultimatum demanding that the victim renounce a given idea without discussion, personally attacking by threatening the victim of being considered morally unworthy, uneducated or just plain stupid. An ad hominem attack.) may be appropriate here.

I’d love to add more, but my beer salsa is dissolving the insect paddies and synthetic ham is soaking my egg substitute breakfast.

answered on Friday, Sep 01, 2023 11:18:41 AM by Dr. Richard

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Nadir writes:

It's not anyone who drinks more than I do.

It's anyone who drinks too much that causes them to hurt their health and/or act inappropriately as a result of that excessive drinking.

 

posted on Friday, Sep 01, 2023 04:17:30 PM
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Petra Liverani writes:

[To Nadir]

Nadir, Dr Richard is having a laugh. Now you may not think alcoholism is a laughing matter and while I myself think that alcoholism is a very serious problem and I don't actually like being around drunk people whether they're alcoholics or just one-off drunk (even though in the distant past I was a drunk person myself on the odd occasion) I can find humour in the subject - if rather hypocritically.

When he says an alcoholic "is anyone who drinks more than I do" what he means is that's how people argue against their own alcoholism. So as the definition of false equivalence includes downplaying differences as well as exaggerating similarities this argument is also a false equivalence - [EDIT] to me it makes more sense to have a completely different fallacy named false non-equivalence but I guess false equivalence works for both from different angles.

Person A doesn't drink as much as Person B, a designated alcoholic, and Person A uses this difference to justify themself not being an alcoholic
Regardless of the difference in the amount they drink, however, Person A drinks sufficiently to also be considered an alcoholic  

[ login to reply ] posted on Friday, Sep 01, 2023 09:50:00 PM
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Bo Bennett, PhD
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I would say that this primarily a strawman fallacy . Person 1 is saying that person 2 is an "alcoholic" and person 2 is substituting a person’s actual position or argument with a distorted, exaggerated, or misrepresented version of the position of the argument. by implying that the argument is actually against drinking alcohol. The fallacy isn't with accusing someone of doing less then what they've done, but in misrepresenting the argument being made.

answered on Friday, Sep 01, 2023 06:08:05 AM by Bo Bennett, PhD

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Nadir writes:

That comes close, but I think Petra Liverani's answer is more accurate. The false equivalence fallacy.

Although there might be an argument for strawman, or at least in certain situations.

posted on Friday, Sep 01, 2023 03:43:10 PM
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Bo Bennett, PhD writes:
[To Nadir]

The important thing is that you can argue the fallacy you choose persuasively.

[ login to reply ] posted on Friday, Sep 01, 2023 03:45:33 PM
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Nadir writes:
[To Bo Bennett, PhD]

Yes partly true

[ login to reply ] posted on Friday, Sep 01, 2023 04:12:21 PM