I feel this is reductive
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Original Question
From here:
Sorry, but intersex people don't actually exist, in the sense that I think you're trying to imply. No one is born with both sexes or somewhere in the middle of both sexes.
What happens is that people are born with a given sex and they have a defective development. It's the same thing as a person who is born without a limb. Or one who is born blind. Being born without a limb (or an eye) doesn't mean there are infinitely many basic human forms. (i.e. one head, two arms, one torso, two legs, etc.). It simply means that the person so born didn't develop the normal human form.
So too, when a person is born as one sex and develop characteristics of the other sex, it is because they have a deformity. It's not because they're stuck in between the sexes. They are always one sex or the other, but they have an abnormal development that causes external confusion in some way. This may involve a man who lives as a woman, because they developed male characteristics as a child, for instance. Or vice versa. But the man living as a woman still won't be able to give birth to children in the normal way. Just as trans people (who have transitioned) cannot have children in the normal way either.
Answers
3A response from AI:
The claim presented contains several inaccuracies and misconceptions about intersex individuals and conditions. Here's a breakdown of what is correct and what is incorrect:
### Inaccuracies and Misconceptions:
1. **Existence of Intersex People:**
- The claim that "intersex people don't actually exist" is incorrect. Intersex people do exist. Intersex is a broad term that encompasses various conditions in which a person's reproductive or sexual anatomy doesn't fit typical definitions of male or female. This can involve variations in chromosomes, gonads, sex hormones, or genitals.
2. **Nature of Intersex Conditions:**
- The claim that "no one is born with both sexes or somewhere in the middle of both sexes" oversimplifies the reality of intersex conditions. While it is true that most intersex people do not have fully developed reproductive systems of both sexes, there are many ways in which sex characteristics can be atypical. Intersex conditions are diverse, and can range from ambiguous genitalia to differences in internal reproductive organs and chromosomal patterns.
3. **Comparison to Developmental Defects:**
- Comparing intersex conditions to being born without a limb or blind is a misleading analogy. While intersex traits can involve atypical development, they are not inherently "defective" or "deformities." This language pathologizes intersex bodies and can contribute to stigma. Intersex variations are natural occurrences in human biology.
4. **Sex and Gender:**
- The assertion that intersex people are always "one sex or the other" with "abnormal development" ignores the complexity of sex and gender. Sex is not strictly binary (male or female); it includes a range of biological attributes. Gender is a separate concept from biological sex and encompasses a person's identity, roles, and social expectations, which can vary widely.
5. **Reproductive Capabilities:**
- The statement about trans people and intersex people not being able to have children "in the normal way" oversimplifies and inaccurately conflates different groups. Some intersex individuals can have biological children, and reproductive capabilities can vary widely. Additionally, trans people (those who transition from one gender to another) may have different reproductive options depending on their medical choices and biological factors.
### Accurate Aspects:
1. **Developmental Variations:**
- It is accurate to say that intersex traits result from variations in typical development. However, framing these variations as "defective" or "deformities" is not appropriate or respectful.
### Conclusion:
The claim contains significant inaccuracies and reflects a misunderstanding of intersex conditions. Intersex people do exist, and their experiences and characteristics are diverse. It is essential to approach the topic with accurate information and sensitivity to the complexities of human biology and gender.
### 1. Misunderstanding Fallacy
The argument begins by stating, "intersex people don’t actually exist, in the sense that I think you’re trying to imply." This shows a misunderstanding or misrepresentation of what "intersex" means. Intersex is a well-documented biological phenomenon where individuals are born with physical sex characteristics that do not fit typical binary notions of male or female bodies. This is a form of **Straw Man Fallacy**, as it misrepresents the actual complexity and variety of intersex conditions.
### 2. Reductive Analogies
The analogy of intersex conditions to being born without a limb or blind is overly simplistic and flawed. Comparing intersex conditions (which are natural variations in human biology) to disabilities (which are often impairments of typical human functions) is not appropriate and diminishes the unique nature of intersex experiences. This comparison leads to a **False Analogy Fallacy**.
### 3. Biological Essentialism
There is an underlying assumption in the argument that there are only two "normal" sexes and anything else is a "defective development". This perspective is a form of **Biological Essentialism**, which asserts that biology rigidly defines all aspects of gender and sex, ignoring the complex interplay of genetics, hormones, and internal and external reproductive organs.
### 4. Appeal to Normality
The argument implies that being "normal" is defined strictly by the ability to reproduce "in the normal way". This is an **Appeal to Normality Fallacy**, suggesting that what is considered "normal" is inherently correct and preferable, without justification for why "normal" should be the standard. It marginalizes those who do not fit into this narrowly defined category.
### 5. Ignorance of Modern Science
The argument disregards extensive scientific research and consensus around intersex variations. Modern biology recognizes intersex as a naturally occurring variation, not merely a defect. This disregard for scientific consensus and evidence is a **Fallacy of Ignorance**.
### 6. False Dichotomy
By stating that individuals are always one sex or the other but may have "abnormal development," the argument presents a **False Dichotomy**. It insists on a binary view of sex and ignores the spectrum of intersex conditions that modern science recognizes.
### 7. Logical Inconsistency
The assertion that "no one is born with both sexes or somewhere in the middle of both sexes" contradicts case studies and medical documentation of conditions such as Androgen Insensitivity Syndrome, Congenital Adrenal Hyperplasia, and others which show a genuine spectrum of sex characteristics. This inconsistency makes the argument logically weak.
### Conclusion
The argument is characterized by a combination of logical fallacies, cognitive biases (such as confirmation bias and essentialism), and scientific inaccuracies. It is important to understand intersex variations through an informed and evidence-based perspective rather than relying on reductive and inaccurate analogies.
I looked at the whole comment thread for more context. I noticed two things immediately. First is that, in their previous post, this person defined what a woman is using 3 criteria, then in this post contradicted themselves by saying that someone who doesn't fit those criteria is also a woman.
Second thing is that it's also a strawman fallacy argument against the post they're responding to. That post doesn't assert either way whether an intersex person would be classified as a male, female, or something entirely separate. While I think there's an implication that an intersex person would still be male or female, this post argues that an intersex person can only be male or female because there is no other category.
As far as the actual content of this post goes, I think it is, at the very least, poorly worded. Starts out with the claim that "intersex people don't exist" but then goes on to acknowledge their existence, but just disagree on how they're classified by some people. They use the word "deformity" to describe intersex conditions, which is definitely reductive as many intersex conditions present themselves in ways that aren't anatomical, or aren't obvious, to the point where a person with these conditions could go their entire lives without realizing that anything is unusual. They also seem to be really focused on the idea that a person whose gender identity doesn't match their anatomical sex can't reproduce in a normal way, while ignoring that some intersex conditions will cause a person to be sterile. Also that cisgender, non-intersex people can also be sterile for a variety of medical reasons.
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